15ft Sorcerer Project Mercruiser 3.0l parts wanted

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solitaire
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15ft Sorcerer Project Mercruiser 3.0l parts wanted

Post by solitaire »

Progress so far and a cautionary tale.

After the initial delight of getting the big Sorcerer delivered from Scotland and into my garage - I am beginning to have some misgivings about my "unseen" purchase and perhaps lessons learned :grrr:
The boat is sound and the interior fairly original but tired (as you would expect for a 40 year old boat) the previous owner had told me it had been re-gelcoated, which I was delighted to hear - but a tad suspicious as it involves a mass of expensive work! - It turned out to have been repainted with epoxy and not a bad job, apart from the mass of scratches from 20 years in storage - "So far So Good" :thumbsup:

Next thing was to inspect the engine and drive (a 1976 pre Alpha and Mercruiser 140) - First. about 1/2 pint of water came out of the drive oil drain followed by 1/2 pint of filthy heavy gear oil, the water pipe had missed it's location in the upper part of the drive, all the impeller vanes were absent, the UNC and UNF nuts securing the rams and lower unit were transposed and cross threaded, big chunks of cast iron (and impeller vanes) present in the leg exhaust (I was told this engine ran fine with water via "muffs" a few weeks ago)

The cast iron bits in the drive leg made me suspicious of the exhaust :hmmm: - so the next job was to remove the exhaust and riser (common failure items on these older Mercruisers) - only when the exhaust was removed could I clearly see the core plugs straining to pop out and a 2" long crack in the cylinder block
Cracked Block.JPG
(all because the previous owner didn't drain the coolant). So now I have to remove the engine for a full inspection - if this model GM 181 cu ins engine is not drained correctly, it can not only crack the block on the outside - but also at the base of the liner Inside!

Now the engine is fully stripped for inspection - but remembering I had been told the engine was running fine and NEVER given any trouble, I was expecting good things.
Sorcerer engine.JPG
(Our now cat spends it time in the garage - away from our two Setters)
On the up side - the inside was not frost damaged
The head had been grossly over-tightened,it should be 90ft/lbs, I needed a 4ft pipe on my 18" breaker bar to loosen them! (presumably the previous builder had done this to re-use the old head gasket) but in doing so, had cracked the casting around the threads
The crank main and B/E journals had been re-ground (The Vandervell bearings fitted were not GM original)
The main bearing caps (clearly numbered 1-5 by GM had been fitted in the wrong places - (all main bearing journals and bearings badly worn)
Bearing caps wrongly fitted.JPG
No 2 cylinder has had a liner fitted at some time?
No 2 cylinder exhaust camshaft lobe had been worn away so the valve was not opening
The Oil pump is worn out from metal particles and a dirty build
The sump floor was 1/4" thick with sludge and metallic particles

DRAW YOUR OWN CONCLUSIONS, I THINK THE SAYING "BUYER BEWARE" APPLIES - AND I AM SURPRISED THE PREVIOUS OWNER DIDN'T NOTICE THE ENGINE BEING TAKEN OUT OF THE BOAT FOR A VERY SHODDY REBUILD AFTER A MAJOR COMPONENT FAILURE (HE HAD OWNED IT FROM NEW), BUT IT GOES TO SHOW THE HORRORS HIDDEN INSIDE WHAT WAS DESCRIBED AS A GOOD RUNNING ENGINE THAT GAVE NO TROUBLE!!!

Consequsently ............... I am looking for parts -- for a 4 cylinder GM 181cu ins (Mercruiser 3.0) with two part rear oil seal

A Block (preferably standard because at least my pistons and rods are good,
A Crankshaft
A Camshaft and lifters
An Exhaust Riser
A Fuel Pump
Full gasket set, Gimble bearing, lower shift cable, - or a complete "SHORT" motor assy the right price (the cylinder head on this one can be made serviceable)

Initial enquiries indicate short motors and blocks are not available - only "bobtail" (i.e. a new engine with head) assemblies price £3000+ :cry:

My last option and at the moment (possibly my favourite) is to ditch the agricultural Mexican built Mercruiser lump and replace it with some nicer European Volvo Penta technology perhaps a 130 - 140 4 cylinder with a 270/280 drive from someones engine/diesel upgrade, but at the right price

pspeed
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Re: 15ft Sorcerer Project Mercruiser 3.0l parts wanted

Post by pspeed »

Here's a couple

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/mercruiser-3l ... 2208554262

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mercruiser-3- ... 1994921512

Would be better at about £700 each but there doesn't seem to be much about.

You're right about the superior engineering in the VP stuff, however it's all getting a bit old now as well, the later ones (SX) use this 3.0L Mexican block anyway. and you'd have to open up the hole in the transom etc ( for the 280/290), glass new bearers in and all that. sounds like a lot of work to me, I'd be tempted to replace what's there.

The old 140 / 3.0L is a good old agricultural unit when set up properly, and you obviously know what you're doing so I'd stick with it. just be careful on model years etc, you'll probably have to stick with the early manifold and riser to marry up with the collector pipe etc (check that's not rotted through internally as well).
Also check the transom shield isn't rotted out on the bellows location diameter, (very common on the early ones)

Good luck
Phil.

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solitaire
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Re: 15ft Sorcerer Project Mercruiser 3.0l parts wanted

Post by solitaire »

pspeed

Hi and many thanks for the info - I will certainly take a look at the exhaust down pipe, gimble housing and ring, I think my bias towards Volvo Penta come from a forgotten age when I was a warranty engineer for them (v/early 70's) after my apprenticeship with Meakes, mostly on Fjords - running around fitting risers to the old 150V6's and synchronising carbs on the B30's (which I thought was a stonkly good silky smooth engine - plenty available on the dutch market, just a shame the exhausts rot out and no one makes a pattern !!! )

I have to admit I was a tad shocked at the agricultural 1950's construction of the 3.0l GM lump, and the price of the parts (£90 for a proper head gasket and >£120 for a tin timing cover!!) - but I guess it all just about works,

But on the bright side - I have plenty of work on the fuel system, wiring, and interior to keep me busy - and I have all winter to find an engine............something will turn up (under a grand I hope)

Cheers - Solitaire

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solitaire
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Re: 15ft Sorcerer Project Mercruiser 3.0l parts wanted

Post by solitaire »

pspeed

Hi and many thanks for the info - I will certainly take a look at the exhaust down pipe, gimble housing and ring, I think my bias towards Volvo Penta come from a forgotten age when I was a warranty engineer for them (v/early 70's) after my apprenticeship with Meakes, mostly on Fjords - running around fitting risers to the old 150V6's and synchronising carbs on the B30's (which I thought was a stonkingly good, and silky smooth engine - plenty available on the dutch market, just a shame the exhausts rot out and no one makes a pattern !!! )

I have to admit I was a tad shocked at the agricultural 1950's construction of the 3.0l GM lump, and the price of the parts (£90 for a proper head gasket and >£120 for a tin timing cover!!) - but I guess it all just about works,

But on the bright side - I have plenty of work on the fuel system, wiring, and interior to keep me busy - and I have all winter to find an engine............something will turn up (under a grand I hope)

Cheers - Solitaire

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Re: 15ft Sorcerer Project Mercruiser 3.0l parts wanted

Post by Sweep »


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solitaire
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Re: 15ft Sorcerer Project Mercruiser 3.0l parts wanted

Post by solitaire »

Sweep - many thanks - that looks like a good buy - c/w b.w. box and down angle manifold etc. ( its a marriage between a Merc home made alloy block and a half of a Ford V8, but a big thumping 3.7l 4 cyl motor and circa 160/170hp - probably not much more weight than the Mexican 3.0l pile of cast iron pooh in my Sorcerer

I have purchased another used 3.0L and built one from two but with new pistons and bearings - word is they only make about 110 - 120 hp, if your lucky, originally sold as 2.5l 120hp and 3.0l 140hp but many of the 3.0l units only had 2.5l 120hp cylinder heads fitted at the factory to use up stock of the old automotive parts - guess that's why they called them 3.0l engines for a while - not wishing to state the true hp.

So, mine is a Bassets (allsorts) engine with a 3.0l block, 140 head, 3.0 l carb (Mercarb) and manifold, but I have kept the old 140 Ignition system (coil and points) rather than the 3.0l electronic system
rebuilt motor.JPG

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Re: 15ft Sorcerer Project Mercruiser 3.0l parts wanted

Post by Alacrity »

Knowing you & you history that will be one sweet running pile of pooh! :D
Mercs are like women, no 2 are exactly alike. That's what testing is about. In general it is safer to test motors and props than women!

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